Question

Raised on behalf of Nicholas Buttle from email sent to the Twiki development mailing list

Seems to me that Twiki is infinitely more difficult to manage as an admin and infinitely more difficult to use as a user. I'm comparing it with mediawiki for use in our organisation. I've heard that it's better for our desired setup and I can believe it but if it's really hard to get to learn then nobody's going to contribute to the damned thing.

Is there either a simple tutorial (and I don't mean the ones on the Twiki site....!!!)

Or

Is there a way to setup a minimal Twiki to start small and build up from there?

Also, some sort of clear guide to customising the skin/stylesheet...

If I'm in the wrong mailing list then sorry...blame the Twiki.

TIA

Nicholas

Environment

-- KennethLavrsen for Nicholas Buttle - 19 Oct 2006

Answer

Nicholas

Your feedback is very close to useless because you are not all specific. TWiki can do a lot of advanced stuff. But what you need to learn to use the basics takes 20 minutes.

You will soon learn that the advanced stuff are pretty nice features.

You address two issues here.

• Admin: Installation.
• User: Tutorial

On the admin thing. Please try and be specific.

What trouble have you run into?

Do you have TWiki running now?

And on the user tutorial. Did you look carefully at the documents?

There are some very simple tutorials that are available on your own Twiki once it is installed.

-- KennethLavrsen - 19 Oct 2006

On the question of customising the skin: have a look at TWiki06x01/PatternSkin (the default skin). You can find basic how-to's in the linked topics from there.

-- ArthurClemens - 19 Oct 2006

'Your feedback is very close to useless because you are not all specific'...a bit rude but never mind.

I have Twiki setup on Mac OS X and it works. But my complaint is that it seems pretty hard to customise, use as an administrator, use as a user...

With mediawiki I was up and running in far less time...I'm looking for a simple system that ordinary non IT expert users will enjoy getting involved with and so far I can't see how this will happen on a Twiki. If I can't make much sense of it then how will my users feel comfortable with it? Simply explaining to users that they have to use WikiWords to start a page is going to be difficult enough.

As an example...I set up the Twiki and entered the configure area. It was not at all clear how I could create users/user groups and assign them page privileges. I think I figured it out but I'm not sure if I did it right.

Anyway, I'll stick with it but I'm pretty sure that whatever the benefits of the Twiki they will be undermined by the fact that my users will find it hard to use...

I'll let you know.

TIA

Nicholas

-- NicholasButtle - 19 Oct 2006

further to this...I tried setting up Twiki using the Indigoperl setup on my PC at home...Indigoperl setup fine...but following the IndigoPerlCookBook instructions led to a failed installation at step 10.

Permission denied at ../tools/rewriteshbang.pl line 71

Checked the path as advised but there's no error there...so?

mmm...

-- NicholasButtle - 19 Oct 2006

Nicholas, your concerns are valid. But here are some explanations:

• Something you already know is always easier to use than something new
• TWiki main strength are:
  • Structure (you can build applications in TWiki)
  • Stability (changes slowly, and does not forces changes on you)
  • Intranet use (customizability, adaptability to existing setups, extensibility)
  • Reliability (no database)
  • Open Source

This can explain why you will find TWiki less usable "out-of-the-box" than other wikis. The intended audience (Intranet admins) are more used to take some time with the tools first if it means a better understanding of the tool and a better reliability in the long term.

For instance I manage 8 TWikis for 5 years, and TWiki stability is paramount for me. Its flexibility means that you will be able to customise it for your users for ease of use (company-specific templates, processes, ...)

-- ColasNahaboo - 20 Oct 2006

The main complains that I read in the text are:

• Using WikiWords to start a page is difficult to explain to users: Yes, you're absolutely right there. And for that I have good news for you and your users: Links can be created using the same syntax as MediaWiki (surround the page/phrase with [[]]). Even more, the http links will render automatically (example: http://www.google.com).
• Hard to customize
• Hard to create user/groups, and to assign privileges
• Unexpected problem with Indigo Perl.

-- RafaelAlvarez - 20 Oct 2006

Some tips:

• Admin training:
  • Take some time to study topics listed in your TWiki web home
  • The Admin Tools topic lists most topics needed to maintain your TWiki
• User training: There is very little needed to get started.
  • For new users to get started, point them to WelcomeGuest (see link to it in Main.WebHome of your installation.)
  • Organize training sessions, ATasteOfTWiki is a good base (presentation included in the TWiki distribution)
  • For those who prefer to study more details by themselfs, point them to TWikiTutorial (also included in the TWiki distribution)
• Customization:
  • TWiki can be customized probably more than any other wiki
  • For skins, I would start in TWikiSkins and PatternSkin (both are in your installation), and follow the links on customization.
  • There is a lot of documentation in the TWiki web of your installation. (BTW, if you think that it is hard to find by all means, please help improve the navigation. You are invited to work directly in the TWiki web on twiki.org.)
  • Ask here in the Support web, or drop by in TWikiIRC

You will find that the TWiki community can be very helpful, just ask in a friendly way, and you get a friendly reply

-- PeterThoeny - 21 Oct 2006

Above list makes a nice summary for TWiki.WebHome.

-- ArthurClemens - 21 Oct 2006

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