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NatSkinDev Discussion: Page for developer collaboration, enhancement requests, patches and improved versions on NatSkin contributed by the TWikiCommunity.
• Please let us know what you think of this extension.
• For support, check the existing questions, or ask a new support question in the Support web!
• Please file bug reports in the NatSkin bug database.
• See NatSkinDevArchive for older discussions.

Feedback on NatSkin / NatSkinPlugin

Moved old discussions to NatSkinDevArchive.

-- MichaelDaum - 23 Aug 2006

I have noticed that, when using NatSkin (the PatternSkin style) and the EDITTABLE plugin together, my browser appears confused about the horizontal width of the table.

You can see the problem at RandomTestTopic7740

bug report at Bugs:Item2633

-- VickiBrown - 17 Jul 2006

Hi Michael,

I am very new in this area but I like to ask you some question about your intention: The SmartEditAddOn has some nice features when editing a wiki topic: e.g.: Searching for an internal TWiki page to link to an also give an preview window for this internal and also for n externel http address. I guess this is a fine feature. Next one is the possibility to search forward an backward in an edit text area. Do you have made some plans to add those feature to natedit ?

Next question is about twiki pattern style template oopsmore.tmpl and the possibility to DELETE topics. As I know, its the same as moving topic to trash but the pattern skin would create an new (mostly) logical and unique new web name for topics to be deleted.

Last but not least question smile for today is about translation of skin. Do made any decision already to have some german translated files ? Or why havent't you use the function. I think missing time is the reason for that ?

Looking for your answer. Tom.

P.S.: I made same changes to oopsmore.nat.tmpl to have your search and the normal backlinks search. If you are interested, how should I post you such suggestions ?

-- ThomasFreudenberg - 18 Aug 2006

The edit toolbar in NatSkin (natedit) is very new and only supports some basic editing help. For now I don't have plans to add the same advanced wikiwyg features to natedit as found in SmartEditAddOn and a couple of other wikiwyg editors. There's still a way to go for them as they still need some time to mature. Adding the natedit candy only provides the same functionality as MediaWiki's edit toolbar does. Adding more features will be done very carefully if at all and much more conservative. There are lots of nice features that could be added to wiki editing in general but I am afraid most users will simply be overwhelmed by them. So frankly NatSkin is not the right place to add them but make it an independent addon.

NatSkin deliberately removed the move/rename functions from oopsmore and has put it into a dialogue of its own that is reachable right away (clicking on Move). That' why it is not on oopsmore. But taking care of duplicate topic names in the trash web makes sense. Will look into that.

Translation of NatSkin is on the way and will be available in v3.0.

Yes, send me your oopsmore changes. I am very interested. Thanks.

-- MichaelDaum - 21 Aug 2006

Hi Michael,

I have attached my latest changes as a diff file for NatSkin (pre-4). Changes will add a form element to seach for backlinks with the backlinksweb - templates and renames your additional backlinks mechanism (natsearch) to make clear that these are two different operations. Hope you could agree with this, cause natsearch will find more topic than the standard backlinks and sometimes a user would prefer that. So for now he has the two options.


-- ThomasFreudenberg - 21 Aug 2006

Please help, I have problem with some functions in NatEdit:

  • Preview - does not work
  • Add Form - does not work
  • Abadon - works
  • Save - does not work
  • Save and exit - does not work
  • Cancel - does not work

-- MartinMinka - 19 Aug 2006

Will be fixed in the next pre-release.

-- MichaelDaum - 21 Aug 2006

I upgraded with the 15 aug NatSkinPlugin. Suddenly USERACTIONS expands to a string like this | | | | | . I re-installed the old version and USERACTIONS is again something like Edit|Attach|Move|Raw|Diffs|More .


-- LucaBagolin - 19 Aug 2006

Which TWiki version are you using? Did you enable locale support? Try to disable it.

NatSkin is currently in progress to be localized. That's why the current pre-releases are a bit more unstable than previous once. I hope to be able to package a new one today.

-- MichaelDaum - 21 Aug 2006

I found a bug in edittoolbar.natedit.tmpl for natedit. The Buttons "Preview your changes", "Save and exit", "Save and continue editing" and "Save and exit" doesn't work. The "href="javascript:" for these Buttons must be "submitEditForm" in place of "submitEditFormular" !! Chnage them and it should work.

-- TWikiGuest - 23 Aug 2006

Hi Titus, this has been fixed in a recent pre-release already.

-- MichaelDaum - 23 Aug 2006

I installed the 3.00 pre6 version. It seems that the global search (g:abc) is broken.

-- TorstenUeckert - 30 Aug 2006

I tried a little bit and it seems like the braking change is from

  # construct the list of webs to search in
  my @webList = ($theWeb);
  if ($options =~ /g/) {
    @webList = TWiki::Func::getPublicWebList();
    @webList = grep (/^$includeWeb$/, @webList) if $includeWeb;
    @webList = grep (!/^$excludeWeb$/, @webList) if $excludeWeb;
    @webList = grep (!/^$theWeb$/, @webList);
    @webList = sort @webList;
    unshift @webList, $theWeb;
  # construct the list of webs to search in
  my @webList = ($theWeb);
  if ($options =~ /g/) {
    @webList = sort TWiki::Func::getPublicWebList();
    @webList = grep (/^$includeWeb$/, @webList) if $includeWeb;
    @webList = grep (!/^$excludeWeb$/, @webList) if $excludeWeb;
    @webList = grep (!/^$theWeb$/, @webList);
    unshift @webList, $theWeb;

Although both seem to be equivalent.

-- TorstenUeckert - 31 Aug 2006

I recognized some minor things with 3.00-pre6:

  • The NatSkin_installer.pl is looking for a 3.00-pre1 version of NatSkinPlugin, although I have installed pre6 of it.
  • The NatSkinPlugin_installer.pl is always complaining about a missing TWiki:Plugins:/Dakar.contrib, downloads and installs it everytime, while still complaining the next time. Maybe I did something wrong with my installation?
  • In registernotify.nat.tmpl are still some %NATSCRIPTURL{}% references.

-- TorstenUeckert - 05 Sep 2006

I opened this page NatSkinInstallerError. I don't know if it is a NatSkin problem or not, but I'm not able to install it. It seems like something is missing. May You help me? Thanks. Luca.

-- LucaBagolin - 05 Sep 2006

I've just tried to download and manually install the current version of the skin, and I didn't run into any trouble there, but its preview doesn't look very good in SkinBrowser: all text and plain text variable names, spread out all over the page. I assume that indicates a problem... also tried the perl installer, which exited as follows:

# perl NatSkin _installer

### NatSkin Installer ###

This installer must be run from the root directory of your TWiki installation. * The script will not do anything without asking you for confirmation first (unless you used -a). * You can abort the script at any point and re-run it later * If you answer 'no' to any questions you can always re-run the script again later ########################################################## Checking dependency on TWiki::Plugins::NatSkinPlugin.... * NatSkin depends on perl package TWiki::Plugins::NatSkinPlugin >=3.0-pre1 which is described as "Required. Download from the TWiki:Plugins/NatSkinPlugin code library." But when I tried to find it I got this error:

Can't locate TWiki/Plugins/NatSkinPlugin.pm

Would you like me to try to download and install the latest version of NatSkinPlugin from twiki.org? [y/n] y Undefined subroutine &TWiki::getInstaller called at NatSkin _installer line 541, line 1.

What I see immediately is that the installer is looking for TWiki/Plugins/NatSkinPlugin.pm, which doesn't exist (there is no TWiki" directory at the root of my TWiki package installation).

I'm running on Linux (RHEL4) with the latest TWiki package.

-- JohnDeStefano - 18 Oct 2006

I have a bug with either NatSkin TwistyPlugin, or my TWiki. I use TWiki VM 4.0.4 and have installed NatSkin v3.0-pre10. In IE 6 when editing a page, clicking the More button under the textarea momentarily shows the options and then the page loads into the view mode. I think this is because the More hyperlink contains a # and the page has /bin/view rather than /bin/edit in its hyperlink base. This problem does not occur in firefox, which must ignore the hyperlink base for # links. The way I resolved the problem was to add onclick="return false;" to the # hyperlink on line 170 of TwistyPlugin.pm. I understand adding onclick="return false;" is good practice if a link is just used to trigger javascript, but I don't know if this was the right thing to do in these circumstances.

-- AndrewSpeakman - 20 Oct 2006

NatSkin _Installer Line 541: my $script = getInstaller( $module ); Should be changed to: my $script = getArchive( $module );

-- NickMichels - 26 Oct 2006

OK! I edited line 541 and all is going again. Thank you very much.

-- LucaBagolin - 29 Oct 2006

I can not make the SectionalEditPlugin work with NatSkin. When I add sectioning tags to the raw text, I get the dotted line frames around the sections and the edit buttons for each section. However, when I click on an edit button I am redirected to a new page with a single heading "HereComesTheNameOfTheTopic (edit)" and a twisty section with text formatting tips. Any ideas how this could be fixed?

-- TorstenUeckert - 31 Oct 2006

I have some issue while using NatSkin (the Kubric Skin style) and the EDITTABLE plugin together.If the edittable has more number of columns ,contents in the last column of the edittable are not completely displayed.Is there any idea how this could be fixed?

-- SarikaKulkarni - 17 Nov 2006

Well your table is too big. The only way to have it on the screen is to use a layout variation your content fits or add

<div style="overflow:auto">
around content that tends to bloat the page horizontally.

-- MichaelDaum - 17 Nov 2006

Thank you very much Michael.Above syntax helped to resolve the issue.

-- SarikaKulkarni - 20 Nov 2006

WikiWord notation doesn't create automagically links in TWikiForm attached to Nat skin topics. Why ?

For example : http://micha.wikiring.de/Applications/DiscussionApp/WebLinks

-- ThierryPasquier - 22 Nov 2006

I've been trying to chase down the


Is there any chance you will make that more like WebTopicActions in a future release? I like your solution for handling logged-in/logged-out users; is it possible to add something like GuestUserActions and WikiUserActions topics?

-- CristosLianidesChin - 27 Nov 2006

For compatibility with the SubscribeAddOn package, I modified the WebTopicActions topic as follows:

<a href="%NATLOGINURL%" rel="nofollow" accesskey="l" title="%MAKETEXT{"Login to [_1]" args="<nop>%WIKITOOLNAME%"}%">%TMPL:P{"LOG_IN"}%</a>
| <a href="%SCRIPTURLPATH{"view"}%/%TWIKIWEB%/TWikiRegistration" accesskey="r" title="%MAKETEXT{"Register on [_1]" args="<nop>%WIKITOOLNAME%"}%">%MAKETEXT{"Register"}%</a>
<a href="%NATLOGOUTURL%" rel="nofollow" accesskey="" title="%MAKETEXT{"Logout of [_1]" args="<nop>%WIKITOOLNAME%"}%">(<em>%TMPL:P{"LOG_OUT"}%</em>)</a>
| <a href="%SCRIPTURLPATH%/subscribe%SCRIPTSUFFIX%/%$nopWEB%/%$nopTOPIC%" title="%MAKETEXT{"Add topic to notification list"}%" rel="nofollow">%MAKETEXT{"Subscribe to Topic"}%</a>
%FIDEFINED% <!-- -->
<div class="natUserActions">%USERACTIONS%</div>%STOPINCLUDE%

To fit the space, I moved the "Print" link into the main body. In view.nat.tmpl:

<div style="float:right;"><a href="%SCRIPTURLPATH{"view"}%/%BASEWEB%/%BASETOPIC%?skin=print.nat" rel="nofollow" accesskey="p" title="%MAKETEXT{"Print this page"}%"> %ICON{"printtopic"}% %MAKETEXT{"Printer-Friendly"}%</a></div>
<div class="natBreadCrumbs">%BREADCRUMBS{separator="<span class='natSep'>»</span>"}%</div>%TMPL:END%

I hope this is useful to anyone who's looking to make similar adjustments.

-- CristosLianidesChin - 28 Nov 2006

installer script seems to be broken. I made the change to line 541 described above, and that fixed the first error, but now after the plugins packages are downloaded and extracted I get the error:

   Got local archive from /home/httpd/twiki/RedDotPlugin.tgz
   Can't open perl script "install": No such file or directory
   Installation of RedDotPlugin failed.
..and so on for the rest.

-- MattWilkie - 21 Dec 2006

On the NatSkinPlugin page it says:

  ...customize the default style adding the variables SKINSTYLE,

which links to NatSkin where there is no mention of those variables.

I see in my local copy of the NatSkin documentation that there is a working link to NatSkinConfiguration where they are documented. You might want to get twiki.org updated.

You might also want to update the install instructions to add a step that guides the user to the local copy of the instructions where they can then click through to the local NatSkinStyleBrowser.

-- TomMetro - 28 Dec 2006

On the NatSkinPlugin page it says:

  By default the NatSkin comes with predefined components 
 ...every web can define a component of its own but if it is not 
 defined locally a predefined component will be returned. Components 
 can be predefined in the Main and the TWiki...

While the NatSkin page does mention these components under Customizing webs using WebComponents, it doesn't explain the search order or have links to the web component topic pages themselves. It seems this information shouldn't be buried under the WEBCOMPONENT tag documentation, and instead should be covered by a few paragraphs in the upper level NatSkin documentation. Perhaps combined with the other information on customization, like CSS and templates. The topics could be listed by the degree to which they deviate from the stock NatSkin - such as config variables, web components, CSS, templates, source code.

-- TomMetro - 28 Dec 2006

I have a table that has 10 columns. I need to fit this in one page. I have used the above suggestion of

<div style="overflow:auto">
</div> .
However, this works well in Firefox. In IE the table does not show the scroll bar at the bottom &hence leaves the last 3 columns inaccessible. Can anyone suggest someway around this?

-- AlethaTavares - 01 Jan 2007

Add a fixed width to the surrounding div for IE only by using the underscore conditional css: _width:800px; IE will use this width value while others ignore it. Note, however, that your css will not validate anymore.

-- MichaelDaum - 02 Jan 2007

The WEBLINK variable defined by the NatSkinPlugin does not appear to respect the HOMETOPIC variable, as defined in the target web.

-- TomMetro - 02 Jan 2007

I have the same problem MattWilkie reported on 21 Dec 2006 - the install script is unable to install any of the dependencies, and fails with this error: Can't open perl script "install": No such file or directory

I am running 4.0.5 on Solaris.

-- JohnWorsley - 03 Jan 2007

That's a known issue. Quite a few plugins have been build using a broken BuildContrib. While the BuildContrib has been fixed, not every plugin has been repackaged to include a fixed installer. I am still reworking quite some bits on the NatSkin before I can publish a new version. So for now, you have to resort to manual downloading the depending plugins. Sorry, please be patient.

-- MichaelDaum - 05 Jan 2007

Here is a Perl script you can use to install NatSkin. Run it from your download directory as the downloaded zip files will be left in the current directory. Just give the TWiki installation directory as parameter. Tested on 4.0.4.

Restart Apache after installation if you are running mode_perl. That script can also copy LeftBar topics to SideBar topics but that function is disabled by default. To enable it just edit the file and uncomment the line. That function is most useful if you have a lot of users using their left bar and you want to migrate from pattern skin to nat skin.

Warning, important That script is still missing something like chown -R apache:apache . for sorting out file ownership.

-- StephaneLenclud - 12 Jan 2007

Is NatSkin compatible with SectionalEditPlugin ? It's functional but it's using the a default edit template.

-- StephaneLenclud - 12 Jan 2007

Hi Stephane, the new version is compatible with the SectionalEditPlugin.

Micha, it looks like you've made a number of nice improvements smile

-- KeithHelfrich - 05 Feb 2007

  • Global search appears to jump to a topic if it founds only one result in a web ignoring the fact that there might results in other webs.
  • STYLESIDEBAR on user topic does not override STYLESIDEBAR from web preferences. I can confirm that behavior Micha. Does that also affects other NatSkin preference tag?

-- StephaneLenclud - 22 Feb 2007

Yes, the search behaves as you say and this is the documented behavior. So I added a new flag NATSEARCHGLOBALSEARCH = on/off to enable global search by default. This will be included in the next release.

Stephane, I can't confirm the STYLESIDEBAR behavior you described. This is using the normal TWiki preference mechanism. So if there was an error it would not only affect NatSkin preference values but all of TWiki. I just tested it. I added STYLESIDEBAR = off to Main.TWikiPreferences and added STYLESIDEBAR = left to my home topic. All works as expected. The only topic that still has its sidebar switched off is that of Main.TWikiPrefernces itself, because topic preferences are even stronger than user preferences in twiki. Please check other topics in your twiki if they behave as you want, not the Main.TWikiPreferences topic.

-- MichaelDaum - 22 Feb 2007

  • Thanks again for the new search preference Michael and the lightning fast free support smile It seems like natsearch does funny things sometimes. Like not searching the content of the topics if it finds result(s) in the topics titles. Maybe it's specified that way but it would be great to be able to customize that behaviour through preferences. Maybe it's already possible smile I'll take a closer look at that at some point.

  • Preference issue: Very weird, I double checked every thing. It seems web preferences are not overridden by user preferences on my TWiki (4.0.5 I believe). Though user preferences do override site preferences. Nothing specific to NatSkin it seems. Sorry for the trouble. I'll upgrade to 4.1.1 ASAP.

-- StephaneLenclud - 23 Feb 2007

Ok I had a look at the NatSearch documentation. I was happy to see that one could force the content search using /. Minor thing though at some point the doc says the string starts with a /: normal content search. I think the : should not be there.

WIBNIF if we had a NATSEARCHCONTENTSEARCH option? So that one can force content search by default? With that maybe we should also introduce a prefix to force title search.

-- StephaneLenclud - 23 Feb 2007

Good idea, will do.

-- MichaelDaum - 23 Feb 2007

Hi Micheal, thanks for your work on NatSkin and NatSkinPlugin.

Are there any constraints about replacing WebHome with %HOMETOPIC% (e.g. in NatSKinPlugin.pm and BreadCrumbsPlugin.pm) so you can change the %HOMETOPIC% via configure?. Otherwise you have to change all scripts containing WebHome manually...


-- CarloSchulz - 28 Feb 2007

As NAVIGON is in the process of moving its intranet pages into a TWiki web we have stronger customization needs to satisfy corporate identity. In November 2006 we decided to use NatSkin and implemented a NAVIGON style. In fact NatSkin is the package we needed to be able to develop our own skin -or nat style in our case- without fiddling with templates.

We wanted to customize the top bar and get away from the typical web logo, web slogan scheme. To do we changed defaulttopbar.nat.tmpl as follow:


<div class="natTopLeftContents">
<h1 class="natWebTitle">
<a href="%IFDEFINED{"%WEBLOGOURL%" then="%WEBLOGOURL%" else="%WIKILOGOURL%"}%" title="%WEBLOGOALT%" accesskey="h">
<!-- -->%NATWEBLOGO%<!-- --></a><!-- -->
<div class="natWebSlogan">%SITEMAPWHAT%</div>
<div class="natTopLeftContents">

To integrate that in NatSkin we should add a /data/TWiki/TWikiWebTopBar to the distribution containing:

<h1 class="natWebTitle">
<a href="%IFDEFINED{"%WEBLOGOURL%" then="%WEBLOGOURL%" else="%WIKILOGOURL%"}%" title="%WEBLOGOALT%" accesskey="h">
<!-- -->%NATWEBLOGO%<!-- --></a><!-- -->
<div class="natWebSlogan">%SITEMAPWHAT%</div>

Consider also that TWiki comes with a WebTopBar topic I think. So maybe we should call that new web component something like WebTopLeftContents instead. Although I find WebTopBar more appropriate.

Another thing we will need to customize at NAVIGON its the breadcrumbs. With that WebTopBar customization I think the breadcrumbs is the last fixed element in view mode (not customizable from your web browser). Maybe we will need to modify the copyright notice too but I think this is already customizable from your web browser (might be wrong though). LATER: The topic revision and author name at the bottom of the topic should also be made customizable.

BTW it now seems like TWiki is having quite a success story at NAVIGON. I'll try to get a manger to write something about that in TWikiSuccessStories before the end of the year wink

-- StephaneLenclud - 02 Mar 2007

This is a great idea. I will integrate this upstream but name the webcomponent WebTopLeft. It therefor would be consistent to have a WebTopRight component and remove the WebTopicActions component as it is customizable using the WebTopRight component then.

-- MichaelDaum - 02 Mar 2007

What about having the (edit) as a prefix in the page title when editing? I find it's more convenient to have it as a prefix when doing tab browsing. It makes it very easy to spot the one page you were editing. Pattern skin as it as a prefix. I keep changing that edit.nat.tmpl template whenever I update NatSkin wink

-- StephaneLenclud - 07 Mar 2007

I've got a width issue on the NatSkinStyleBrowser (http://twiki.pollenation.net/twiki/bin/view/TWiki/NatSkinStyleBrowser) which was dl'd from the zip on t.o. 7th March.. The width of the table is collapsing using firefox (on ubuntu firefox 2 - seems to be OK on windows firefox 1 - broken on windows firefox 2)... Let me know if I can help test tim (a) pollenation.net

-- TimParkin - 07 Mar 2007

Filed as Bugs:Item3740 and released as NatSkin -3.0-pre13

-- MichaelDaum - 08 Mar 2007

Opened Bugs:Item3768 and checked in those changes and documentation update in regards to web, lineprefix and multiple WEBCOMPONENT parameters.

Usage example:

~~~   webs="%MAINWEB%,User,publiccurrent,%TWIKIWEB%" 
~~~   map="%TWIKIWEB%=System"
~~~   include="\w+|%BASEWEB%"
~~~   exclude="TestCases|Trash" 
~~~   selection="%BASEWEB%" 
~~~   format="   * $percntWEBLINK{web=\"$web\" name=\"$name\"}$percnt$percntWEBCOMPONENT{\"WebLinks\" web=\"$web\" lineprefix=\"   \" multiple=\"on\"}$percnt$n" 
~~~ }%

Current default NatSkin web component usage should not be broken by those changes. Yet we may want to update web component topics and replace %BASEWEB% with %WEB% as that would make them directly usable for inclusion from foreign web using that newly added web parameter.

-- StephaneLenclud - 15 Mar 2007


-- StephaneLenclud - 15 Mar 2007

Yes yes, but if you remove overflow:hidden from the main contents' div, then wide content, like images, will overlap the navigation bar if it is on the right side ... which is frankly a layout error often seen in blogs with a thin centered layout and a navigation bar on the right.

If you want your popup menu to stay on top and not being cropped then try something z-index -ish.

-- MichaelDaum - 15 Mar 2007

z-index won't help in FF. Definitely a FF bug. Not a big deal anyway I can probably override overflow:hidden in the menu CSS. I would have to double check that but I think overflow:hidden is also responsible for hiding large tables when using EDITTABLE in edit mode. (they grow even larger when editing).

-- StephaneLenclud - 16 Mar 2007

Known issue. But overflow:hidden can easily be restricted to those layouts that have the sidebar on the right.

-- MichaelDaum - 16 Mar 2007

I have a few questions regarding the output of NatSearch:

  • 1st: how can I alter the output of a global search so that it looks like the results here on twiki.org (what i mean is that the WEBBGCOLOR of each web is recognized in the search table).
    • I had a look at /twiki/lib/TWiki/Search.pm and found some code that looks like it is responsible for it.
    • Unfortuntely I don't know nothing about perl so I can't do it by myself frown
  • 2nd: I would like to see variables getting expanded in a search.
    • Otherwise some results will look like this: " _SEARCH{" BASETOPIC " scope "topic" nonoise "on" format " Fyi: $formfield(Titel) Titel: $formfield(Titel) Schlagwörter: $formfield(Schlagwoerter ..._"

Thanks in advance

-- CarloSchulz - 16 Mar 2007

The result of a natsearch is displayed using the search.nat.tmpl template. you may however define another template, possibly a topic, using the NATSEARCHTEMPLATE preference variable. That way you can display search results in any kind you like. The BlogPlugin for example uses a customized way to display search results, for example by displaying a "Teaser" formfield. That's needed as the net data in the BlogUp application is in forms, not in topic texts. So normal search won't display anything reasonable at all because it tries to create a short summary based on the first n chars in the topic text.

The default way to display search results in natsearch tries to emulate TWiki's way as close as possible...but not the WEBBGCOLOR thingy. I found this too frisky/uggly. Sorry wink .

The variables in the search results' summary can't be expanded as that would result in a broken page layout too easily. Admitted, the code that generates the summary is a rather crude, trying its best to control the amount of content that is displayed there.

-- MichaelDaum - 16 Mar 2007

Clicking cancel button on section edit ( editsection.nat.tmpl) results in something like http://wiki/view/Dev/%REDIRECTTO%. Maybe it's SectionalEditPlugin isssue though. Looks like %REDIRECTTO% is broken coz it works much better when using %URLPARAM{"redirectto"}% in editsection.nat.tmpl. Don't know to which component %REDIRECTTO% belongs to.

-- StephaneLenclud - 16 Mar 2007

If that cured the problem, then please check it in.

-- MichaelDaum - 16 Mar 2007

Done as Bugs:Item3785.

-- StephaneLenclud - 18 Mar 2007

Warning, important At some point in one of the latest NatSkin release the search was made case sensitive by default. That was quite disturbing for my users as simple searches that use to match topic titles just didn't match anymore. Use NATSEARCHIGNORECASE to make it behave the way it was.

-- StephaneLenclud - 20 Mar 2007

I'm having some trouble getting NatSkin working properly. I have installed all of the necessary plugins, but I'm still getting a lot of code displayed when I try to use the skin - stuff like "%BREADCRUMBS{separator=" » "}%". Any ideas?

-- ClarkCase - 29 Mar 2007

Try installing the BreadCrumbsPlugin.

-- MichaelDaum - 29 Mar 2007

I checked to maked sure that BreadCrumbsPlugin was installed and enabled, and it was. Oddly, then I went to the NatSkin test page, and most of the code was gone. I'm not sure what happened between yesterday afternoon and this morning, but whatever it was made things somewhat better.

I'm still left with "%FLEXWEBLIST{" being displayed. To handle that, I just installed and enabled the FlexWebPlugin. Unfortunately, that didn't seem to fix. When in doubt, reboot. That got it going correctly.

-- ClarkCase - 29 Mar 2007

I dont why and how this happened but the template file oopsleaseconflict.nat.tmpl is broken (at least on my twiki site).

When an edit confict occurs the page looks like this:

pressing "edit anyway (trotzdem bearbeiten)" and "try again ("nochmal versuchen" results in an "Bad Request - Your browser sent a request that this server could not understand." error.

-- CarloSchulz - 23 Apr 2007

Hi, we currently use a highly customized BlueSkin, but are looking to move to a better supported skin. NatSkin seems to be perfect.

I had one request: one of the features that we have added to BlueSkin was a button called "Presentation View". When clicked, it removes the headers, sidebar, footer, forms and attachment tables. This provides much more real estate when projecting a topic on a screen and reduces the need to scroll around. The button itself changes to "Normal View" and restores everything when clicked again. It sounds like NatSkin has all the components needed to enable this. Any thoughts?


-- PankajPant - 26 Apr 2007

Try appending ?skin=plain.nat to the url.

-- MichaelDaum - 26 Apr 2007

Hmmm... seems to be close enough. However, we have implemented it to stick throughout the session ... so you can move between topics while remaining in this mode. I believe NatSkin has the ability to do that.

-- PankajPant - 26 Apr 2007

can anyone help with HowToAddToolbarButtonsUsingNatSkin and DoesNatSkinReallyRequirePerl58

-- SvenDowideit - 30 Apr 2007

The issue with oopsleaseconflict.nat.tmpl disappeared after upgrading to TWiki 4.1.2.

But now I have some other serious problems with NatSearch:

-- CarloSchulz - 02 May 2007

Question: if NatSearch failed it prints out a page with Nothing found. Try again!

How can I add a new search box in the same page?

-- GiuseppeDiGuglielmo - 04 May 2007

The upcoming NatSkin will have a webcomponent WebNothingFound to customize the Nothing found dialog.

-- MichaelDaum - 08 May 2007

Micheal, will you tackle Item3795 in the the upcoming NatSkin? Or do you have a workaround or some hints on how to solve this issue? TIA

-- CarloSchulz - 08 May 2007

...something different: I was trying to indent text underneath a heading like in DokuWiki but I have no idea how to do this.

See IndentHeadersAndTextLikeDokuWiki for more details.

What about implementig this into NatSkin (if possible)? I think this an extremely useful feature because it would increase scanability and findability if you have long docs with many headings.

-- CarloSchulz - 08 May 2007

The core engine would have to add markup surrounding text sections between headings while parsing TML.

-- MichaelDaum - 08 May 2007

Just a remark concerning the editor. Using access key with number is not such a good idea coz then international geek like me can't enter special character anymore using ALT+nnnn.

-- StephaneLenclud - 10 May 2007

Have you got a better set of accesskeys...I ran out of options for all these buttons.

-- MichaelDaum - 10 May 2007

No I don't use those access keys myself. To me it's as fast to type ---+ than to reach for any access key. So I just would not care about having any access key for those. The main advantage of those buttons is to teach newbies the TWiki syntax I think those access keys are not essential. I just came to find out about them cause they prevent me to type in my French characters on a UK keyboard. However I'm a big user of ALT+S, ALT+E, ALT+D, ALT+L. I have to watch the development of NatEditContrib. Maybe you already have the access keys customizable. BTW are you planning to completely take out the editor from NatSkin itself and just add a dependency on NatEditContrib?

-- StephaneLenclud - 11 May 2007

Yes. NatEditContrib is already ahead of the editor in NatSkin. My current dev version of NatSkin does not duplicate that code anymore.

-- MichaelDaum - 11 May 2007

After I installed I no longer have a link to add a new topic. I have no idea where to start though to troubleshoot!!

-- NathanHodge - 16 May 2007

I figured it out, not sure why it wasnt showing but I copied a line from WebLeftBar and added it to TWikiWebLinks and it works.

-- NathanHodge - 16 May 2007

After much tinkering, I finally managed to get the configure->Find Extensions to work. However, the first thing I tried to install (NatSkin) failed since the installer is not bundled in the tgz (that's what the complaint is anyways).

Is this an oversight, or is Configure/UIs/EXTEND.pm not doing the right thing?

-- PankajPant - 21 May 2007

Sorry. This turned out to be a different issue (See Bugs:Item4113).

-- PankajPant - 22 May 2007

I'm trying to install the latest TWiki with NatSkin on a Webhosting server, and after some fiddling about with FTP and cgitelnet I have everything working except natlogon. I've used the installation scripts and followed all the installation instructions for NatSkinPlugin and NatSkin and its dependencies. Everything looks fine, all the paths are set correctly, but when I try to login I always get the following error:

TWiki Installation Error
Template "oopslogon" not found.
Check the configuration setting for {TemplateDir}.

There's nothing in the logs, the template files are in place and readable, and no matter where I put the template dir, I keep getting this result.

And it gets weirder: When I go to the NatSkinStyleBrowser, and then click login, I do get the login page. But if I then try try to login, it says:

TWiki detected an internal error - please check your TWiki logs and webserver logs for more information.
Can't locate object method "login" via package "TWiki::Client"

The logs do show this one (I removed some bits):

Can't locate object method "login" via package "TWiki::Client" at login line 37.
main::logon('TWiki...bit removed...') called at /var/www/html/twiki-412/lib/TWiki/UI.pm line 159
TWiki::UI::__ANON__() called at /var/www/html/twiki-412/lib/CPAN/lib//Error.pm line 379
eval {...} called at /var/www/html/twiki-412/lib/CPAN/lib//Error.pm line 371
Error::subs::try('CODE(0x9409d20)','HASH(0x9f57fc4)') called at /var/www/html/twiki-412/lib/TWiki/UI.pm line 199
TWiki::UI::run('CODE(0x9420f54)') called

I did a fresh install of TWiki 4.1.2 today, and reinstalled NatSkin, NatSkinPlugin and its dependencies. Both problems remain. I'm guessing that this is related to some outdated CPAN lib (as TWiki 4.0 with NatSkinPlugin 2.9993 and NatSkin 2.9994 works fine on the same server), but I don't have a clue as to where to start looking. The configure script doesn't complain about missing or outdated modules, and everything outside natlogon seems to work just fine. Unfortunately I only have about 3 hours per week to spend on getting this site up, and in two weeks it needs to be fully operational for a workshop. :-/ Does anyone have an idea what could be causing this issue?

-- LevienVanZon - 23 May 2007

What is the setting of your LoginManager configuration?

-- MichaelDaum - 23 May 2007

LoginManager is set to 'none', as per the installation instructions. I already made that mistake before. smile

-- LevienVanZon - 23 May 2007

Use TWiki's LoginManager. The login scheme that comes with NatSkinPlugin is deprecated.

-- MichaelDaum - 23 May 2007

Michael, I just got through installing NatSkin on a virgin installation of TWiki 4.1.2. The first thing I ran into is all of the dependencies on other plugins. I noted on the main NatSkin page that the only dependency listed is NatSkinPlugin -- which isn't the case. Perhaps updating the document, making note of all the dependencies would be nice.

Actually, this was a good exercise -- I was able to put "configure" through it's paces -- it handles performing new plugin installations VERY well.

-- SteveRJones - 24 May 2007

Ah, apparently the dependencies are spelled out in the NatSkinPlugin docs. According to the docs, the NatSkinPlugin installer should have downloaded all dependencies - but it did not. I am installing on TWiki 4.1.2 via configure.

-- SteveRJones - 29 May 2007

Another issue/question regarding NatSearch:

If one topic has the word foo in it and foo is already a name of a topic I can't search for topics that have foo in the content anymore.

How can I turn off the jump feature given that NATSEARCHCONTENT isn't working?

Which search is faster, topic name or content? If topic search is faster it would be cool if the jump feature is more strict, eg only jumps to a topic called FooBar if the search string is FooBar. If it's foo bar or foobar or something that does not exactly match the search string the search results should be displayed.

-- CarloSchulz - 30 May 2007

A /foo will search for foo in the content and skip the topic search. I'm gonna release a new version soon with some fixes in that area.

-- MichaelDaum - 30 May 2007

Thanks for the quick answer.

Two more questions/issues:

  1. After setting NATSEARCHTEMPLATE to a customized template NatSearch and WebSearch display search results in a different layout. Are NatSearch and WebSearch related and how can I modify the output of WebSearch so that it looks like the one of my customized template?

  2. The summary does not expand variables but instead it displayes the name of the variables. It would be great if the names of embedded variables wont show up in the summary.
    • I already found out what to do (this includes some more aggressive cleanups for other chars as well): add the following into /twiki/lib/TWiki/Plugins/NatSkinPlugin/search.pm (around line 506)

  $htext =~ s/%.*?\%//go;                       # Remove variables 
  $htext =~ s/[\%\[\]\~\$\{\}\<\>\*\|=_]/ /go;  # remove Wiki formatting chars, variable chars and parameter chars
  $htext =~ s/!!/ /go;                          # remove !! from headings that don't go into TOC

-- CarloSchulz - 31 May 2007

The case sensitivity of the search in the latest version of NatSkin does not work as documented. It looks like Search.pm incorrectly interprets the meaning of the "u" option. Also it looks like the options passed to egrep are incorrect. I've attached a patch that I think corrects the problem. Also it looks as though the default case is sensitive, so I had to set NATSEARCHIGNORECASE to on in my preferences to get a case insensitive search.

-- JohnHampton - 02 Jun 2007

If you're trying to move an attachment as TWikiGuest TWiki (NatSkin) asks you to login.

Afterwards the ?attachment=myfile.doc parameter is lost. So instead of page based on moveattachment.nat.tmpl TWiki (NatSkin) loads a page that is based on renamebase.nat.tmpl.

Users who do not recognize this can accidentally move the entire topic to the trash web instead of just the attachment.

Here's a work around (requires SpreadSheetPlugin): in line 6 in attachtables.nat.tmpl change

<a href="%SCRIPTURLPATH{"attach"}%/%WEB%/%TOPIC%?filename=%A_FILE%&revInfo=1" title='%MAKETEXT{"manage properties of [_1]" args="<nop>%A_FILE%"}%' rel='nofollow'>%MAKETEXT{"props"}%</a>, <a href="%SCRIPTURLPATH{"rename"}%/%WEB%/%TOPIC%?attachment=%A_FILE%" title='%MAKETEXT{"move or delete [_1]" args="<nop>%A_FILE%"}%' rel='nofollow'>%MAKETEXT{"move"}%</a>
%CALC{$IF($EXACT(%WIKINAME%,TWikiGuest),<a href='%NATLOGINURL%' rel='nofollow' accesskey='l' title='TWiki Login'>login</a> required, <a href='%SCRIPTURLPATH{"attach"}%/%WEB%/%TOPIC%?filename=%A_FILE%&revInfo=1' title='%MAKETEXT{"manage properties of [_1]" args="<nop>%A_FILE%"}%' rel='nofollow'>%MAKETEXT{"props"}%</a>, <a href='%SCRIPTURLPATH{"rename"}%/%WEB%/%TOPIC%?attachment=%A_FILE%' title='%MAKETEXT{"move or delete [_1]" args="<nop>%A_FILE%"}%' rel='nofollow'>%MAKETEXT{"move"}%</a>)}%

Filed as bug Item4222

-- CarloSchulz - 07 Jun 2007

Installation problem

Symptom: After installation of NatSkin plugin, the whole installation and also the site crashed. Problem: On my machine the GluePlugin and RedDot plugin would not get installed properly. Solution: The Glue plugin had to be installed using perl GluePlugin _installer.pl. RedDotPlugin had to be installed by manually downloading RedDotPlugin.tgz from https://twiki.cern.ch/twiki/bin/view/TWiki/RedDotPlugin, placing it in the twiki root directory and then doing perl RedDotPlugin _installer (note - no .pl extension).

-- KarstenBreivik - 12 Jul 2007

Installation problem - garbled characters

Symptom: Garbled characters when you access the NatSkin Style Browser at http://yoursite/twiki/bin/view/TWiki/NatSkinStyleBrowser. Problem: Some of the plugins may not be properly installed or enabled. Solution: See the configure script at http://yoursite/twiki/bin/configure and verify that the plugins are installed and enabled. Also see http://yoursite/twiki/bin/view/TWiki/InstalledPlugins to verify that they are indeed enabled.

-- KarstenBreivik - 12 Jul 2007

Installation problem - behind http proxy server Symptom: when running perl NatSkin _installer.pl, nothing happens when downloading the plugins. Problem: Seems the script does not respect the http_proxy environment variable.

-- KarstenBreivik - 12 Jul 2007

Solution: enable proxying in the installation scripts. Add the environment variable http_proxy like this:

export http_proxy=http://proxy.myorg.com:8080

Then add the line


after the line

$lwp = new LWP::UserAgent();

in all the installer scripts.

Perhaps the installer scripts should be updated to support proxy servers.

-- KarstenBreivik - 12 Jul 2007

Install problems - BreadCrumbsPlugin Symptom: BreadCrumbsPlugin _installer fails on first install. It downloads the *.tgz file, but fails to install it.

Problem: Dunno Solution: Run the BreadCrumbsPlugin _installer again, answering "yes" to using the existing archice, which is now in the twiki directory. Now, install goes OK.

-- KarstenBreivik - 12 Jul 2007

Micheal, is it possible to run natsearch under TWikiForWindowsPersonal?

A search leads to the following errors:

Internal Server Error: 
[Tue Jul 24 13:51:13 2007] natsearch.pl: Can't locate URI/Escape.pm in @INC (@INC contains: 
/twiki/twiki/lib/CPAN/lib//5.8.6/ /twiki/twiki/lib/CPAN/lib// 
/twiki/twiki/lib . C:/twiki/perl/lib .) at /twiki/twiki/lib/TWiki/Plugins/NatSkinPlugin/Search.pm line 27. 
[Tue Jul 24 13:51:13 2007] natsearch.pl: BEGIN failed--compilation aborted at /twiki/twiki/lib/TWiki/Plugins/NatSkinPlugin/Search.pm line 27. 
[Tue Jul 24 13:51:13 2007] natsearch.pl: Compilation failed in require at C:\twiki\htdocs\cgi-bin\natsearch.pl line 36. 
[Tue Jul 24 13:51:13 2007] natsearch.pl: BEGIN failed--compilation aborted at C:\twiki\htdocs\cgi-bin\natsearch.pl line 36.

Everything else works just fine. Only natsearch and natlogon (not needed on TWikiForWindowsPersonal) aren't working.

Do I need =CGI::Session=for any of the NatSkin components?

-- CarloSchulz - 24 Jul 2007

Have you already tried to install URI::Escape perl libs?

-- OliverKrueger - 24 Jul 2007

no, I don't know how to install perl/CPAN libs for a local server on windows at all.

On a linux server it's fine. But I have no shell on my win xp laptop from where i can dto something like cpan and then installCGI::Session :-(.

-- CarloSchulz - 24 Jul 2007

Can anyone try to reproduce Bugs:Item4417 on his own installation?

-- StephaneLenclud - 27 Jul 2007

I came up with a fix for the bug mentioned above. See Bugs:Item4417 for details. Micha I'll wait for your feedback to commit those changes.

-- StephaneLenclud - 30 Jul 2007

I'd like to know how i can modify the sidebar buttons and the webbuttons in only one web... From the documentation, i see it's possible, but i don't know how.... Thx

-- GuillaumeBardy - 28 Aug 2007

I'd like to know how i can modify the sidebar buttons and the webbuttons in only one web... From the documentation, i see it's possible, but i don't know how.... Thx

-- GuillaumeBardy - 28 Aug 2007

Create a topic WebButtons to override the default once in Main.TWikiWebButtons or TWiki.TWikiWebButtons. Same approach to the other web components, i.e. WebLinks and WebSideBar. See the documentation on WEBCOMPONENT.

-- MichaelDaum - 28 Aug 2007

Hi. Thanks for the beautiful skin. But... I'm having the same bug described in http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/Support/NatSearchListingBug. Search is fine in Pattern, not in NatSkin. Similar results to the screen shot shown there. Running Plugin version (3.00-pre12, $Rev: 13070 (06 Mar 2007). Please help? This makes TWiki with NatSkiin almost unusable.

-- WilliamLBentley - 14 Sep 2007

I've had some improvement by explicitly setting:

      * Set SEARCHDEFAULTTTYPE = keyword
      * Set NATSEARCHGLOBAL = on
      * Set NATSEARCHCONTENT = off
The text below the Topic names are still sometimes rubbish, but now at least I get a list of topics sorted by Web, which wasn't happening before.

Perhaps this will help locate the problem.

-- WilliamLBentley - 14 Sep 2007

NatSearch has been recoded for the upcomming 3.00-final release. I removed most of the extra switches. NatSearch will still be a combined jump+search box but return the same results as normal WebSearch does.

-- MichaelDaum - 17 Sep 2007

Hello everyone! I would like to thank all of you for the terrific work on this module, it is really great. Now, to business.

Upgrading to 4.1.2 from 4.0.5 (AKA doing a fresh install first) I installed all the Plugins needed for BlogPlugin in their latest versions, and no others. NatSkin is v3.0-pre16. Porting one of the blog test webs, I noticed that with some particular configurations, some extra-text was inserted in the header of the html, and thus, shown by the browser. The options in this BlogPlugin-created WebPreferences are:

   * <nop>Set SKIN = nat
   * <nop>Set USERSTYLEURL = %PUBURLPATH%/%TWIKIWEB%/BlogPlugin/patternstyle.css
   * <nop>Set SKINSTYLE = Kubrick
   * <nop>Set STYLESIDEBAR = right
   * <nop>Set STYLEBORDER= thin
   * <nop>Set STYLEBUTTONS = on
   * <nop>Set STYLEVARIATION = none
   * <nop>Set STYLESEARCHBOX = pos2

The extra rendered text appears in


<script type="text/javascript" src="/twiki/pub/TWiki/TWikiJavascripts/twiki.js"></script>
<script type="text/javascript">
$(function() {
  $(".natMainContents .twikiTable").wrap("<div class='overflow'></div>");

 .natMainHeaderContents, .natRevision, .natWebLocator, .headlinesLogo { display:none; }
.blogAuthor, .blogAuthorSwitch {display:none;}


and is thus shown by the browser before the page itself.

After playing around some of the pages, I noticed that some other stuff was actually screwed up, particularly a fresh install (inaltered Main.WebHome)

would print
 <span id="twistyIdTWikiWebSideBar1hide" class="twistyTrigger twikiUnvisited twistyHidden twistyInited">
<div style="display:inline;" class="twistyPlugin">
and position the list of webs below the normal page, but above the footer.

I found out that revision 52 of NatSkin.zip (21 May 2007 - 12:17) works fine and as expected, but the next revision (53 - 21 Sep 2007 - 09:28) and subsequent show this anomaly. It smells a lot like a bug to me, but I would like to know if someone can get the same results before reporting.

-- MarcoPoli - 15 Oct 2007

Follow up of the problem described in the above post: I did once more a fresh install of TWiki 4.1.2 and got only the required modules for BlogPlugin. The first problem described (the extra text in the HTML header) is persistent, and can be seen everytime a Web created using the BlogFactory utility is created. I tried to overwrite the WebPreferences of this newly created Web with WebPreferences but the symptom persists. The rendered result is:

I don't seem to be able to reproduce it with the Main Web at this time.

Is this some known issue? Possible some perl module? Thanks!

-- MarcoPoli - 15 Oct 2007

huh, seems like something is broken in the latest release. There are not abuttons at all in edit. See NatSkinNoSaveOrCancelButton

-- CarloSchulz - 24 Oct 2007

Please, surround the css in your Blog.WebCss with

<style type="text/css">

-- MichaelDaum - 26 Oct 2007

Thank you so much, Michael, it works perfectly. And thank you for the great work with this and the auxiliary plugins! Now I just have to work on the Save and Cancel buttons. smile

-- MarcoPoli - 27 Oct 2007

I could not fix the lack of "Save and Cancel" buttoms using the comments currently on NatSkinNoSaveOrCancelButton. JQueryPlugin is installed and working, all pretty buttons show up fine in the plugin topic, animations are very pretty, but still no save or cancel buttons. Any ideas?

-- MarcoPoli - 27 Oct 2007

Follow-up: Installing NatEditContrib made the buttons appear when editing pages like WebPreferences, but for some weird reason they are still missing when editing BlogPlugin-related pages like BlogEntry0 or when selecting the "New Posting" buttom. Doing as described in the NatEditContrib manual, setting

SKIN = natedit,nat
makes the buttons appear, even in the BlogPlugin pages, but they are useless, nothing happens when clicked. The ones that used to work such as in WebPreferences are rended useless also. Still welcoming ideas. smile

P.S.-->TWiki.NatEditContrib isn't currently listed as required anywhere, and I am running TWiki 4.1.2.

-- MarcoPoli - 27 Oct 2007

Same problem with no edit buttons here. Had to revert to an earlier version to make it work again (with same old search problems). No buttons at all appear on the edit page.

-- WilliamLBentley - 28 Oct 2007

Which version did you revert to, WilliamBentley?

-- MarcoPoli - 29 Oct 2007


   * Set SKIN = nat 
makes my page "go away".

TWiki 4.12 (installed today) and latest NatSkin installed today using NatSkin _installer.

  • weird result with SKIN - nat:

-- VickiBrown - 25 Nov 2007

While setting up my wiki (4.1.2) i came across the following things related to natedit:

  • it isn't compatible with TagMe, since TagMe relies on beforetextcontents or contentheader template variables, which are not present in natskin. (easily fixed though by modifying view.nat.tmpl and adding a beforetextcontents at the end of contentheader
  • when using natedit in combination with TinyMCE in IE7, the toolbar is not visible (pattern skin works fine though)
  • skin = jquery,natedit.word,natedit,nat doesn't work, skin = jquery,natedit.word,nat does. (it took me quite a while to figure this one out)

-- MarkVanHeeswijk - 20 Dec 2007

I tried to install NatSkin but getting following errors while accessing http://mymachine/twiki/bin/view/TWiki/TWikiPreferences?skin=nat&style=Kubrick

%IFDEFINED{"%METAKEYWORDS%" then="$n"}% %IFDEFINED{"%METAAUTHOR%" glue="off" then=""}% %IFDEFINED{"%METADESCRIPTION%" then=""}% %IFDEFINEDTHEN{"/twiki/pub/TWiki/WebPreferences/favicon.ico"}% %FIDEFINED% %GETSKINSTYLE% %WEBCOMPONENT{"WebJavaScript"}% %WEBCOMPONENT{"WebCss"}% Copyright © by the contributing authors. All material on this collaboration platform is the property of the contributing authors. Ideas, requests, problems regarding TWiki? Send feedback Note: Please contribute updates to this topic on TWiki.org at TWiki:TWiki.TWikiPreferences %IFDEFINEDTHEN{"$percntWEBSYNDICATION$percnt"}% %$nopWEBSYNDICATION% %ELSEDEFINED% Syndicate this site RSSATOM %FIDEFINED%

Configuration Windows XP TWiki-4.2.0-beta1.1.exe plugins BreadCrumbsPlugin FilterPlugin FlexWebListPlugin ifDefinedPlugin NatSkin RedDotPlugin

Enabled all plugins through config interface and change order of plugins to GluePlugin,IfDefinedPlugin,SpreadSheetPlugin I also tried using installer, being behind the proxy server installer cannot connect to server. is there any way to setup proxy info while running installer script.

Thanks in advance

-- BhanuVasireddy - 27 Dec 2007

Bhanu, it does not look like you've properly installed the IfDefinedPlugin. Please have a look at your TWiki.InstalledPlugins if it is active.

-- MichaelDaum - 27 Dec 2007

Michael, Thanks for your response. IfDefinedPlugin is showing up in console as installed plugin. one interesting thing I noticed in console is some of the plugins have red icon next to their names. I cant figure out the reason.

I changed the whole direction, instead of using installer I went for separate components and now I am getting following error after deploying all NatSkin downloads .

Error: cant move focus to the control because it is invisible, not enabled, or of a type that does not accept the focus.

Set Skin = "jquery, nat"

1.Nat plugin and dependencies are installed

2. Nat skin installed.

3. Jquery installed.

4. NatEdit is also installed, but some reason not showing up under plugin tab on preferences page.

Env: windows, TWiki-4.2.0-rc2.zip, indigoperl-2005.02.zip

Plugin Info from console

Installed Plugins The plugins listed below were discovered by searching the @INC path for modules that match the TWiki standard e.g. TWiki/Plugins/MyPlugin.pm. {Plugins}{BreadCrumbsPlugin}{Enabled}d {Plugins}{CommentPlugin}{Enabled} {Plugins}{EditTablePlugin}{Enabled} {Plugins}{EmptyPlugin}{Enabled} {Plugins}{FilterPlugin}{Enabled}d {Plugins}{FlexWebListPlugin}{Enabled}d {Plugins}{GluePlugin}{Enabled}d {Plugins}{IfDefinedPlugin}{Enabled}d {Plugins}{InterwikiPlugin}{Enabled} {Plugins}{JQueryPlugin}{Enabled}d {Plugins}{NatSkinPlugin}{Enabled}d {Plugins}{PreferencesPlugin}{Enabled} {Plugins}{RedDotPlugin}{Enabled}d {Plugins}{RenderListPlugin}{Enabled}d {Plugins}{SlideShowPlugin}{Enabled} {Plugins}{SmiliesPlugin}{Enabled} {Plugins}{SpreadSheetPlugin}{Enabled} {Plugins}{TablePlugin}{Enabled} {Plugins}{TinyMCEPlugin}{Enabled} {Plugins}{TwistyPlugin}{Enabled} {Plugins}{WysiwygPlugin}{Enabled} Plugins Order SpreadSheetPlugin

Any help on this highly appreciated. already spent lot of time on this.

-- BhanuVasireddy - 31 Dec 2007

First, thanks for a wonderful skin for twiki. We're using twiki 4.12 along with natskin. One minor issue that we're seeing is if people use Firefox ( and hover on and off the wikiwyg buttons several times, the tooltips will stay on even when the cursor is off the button. The only way to get rid of it is if you over over any of the buttons again to get rid of it. We do not see this problem with IE7.

Thanks for any help!

-- DanWang - 11 Jan 2008

Yes, thats a jQuery issue, more specific an issue of the shipped jquery.tooltip plugin. Does anybody know of a better jquery tooltip implementation?

-- MichaelDaum - 11 Jan 2008

Hi i´d like to use the Nat skin in combination with the Kupu editor. Is there any way to configure it like this?

-- SvenHeupel - 15 Jan 2008

I'm gonna be looking at upgrading from 4.1.2 to 4.2. How does the latest NatSkin behaves on 4.2? Anyone tried it already?

-- StephaneLenclud - 24 Jan 2008

NatSkin's main development platform is TWiki-MAIN, since a couple of years now. I only test TWiki < 4.2 before releases.

-- MichaelDaum - 24 Jan 2008

I was concerned about the integration with the new default wysiwyg edit. So how does that work on 4.2? If you do a raw edit you get the NatSkin editor and if you do a normal edit you get the new wysiwyg right? I'll upgrade in 2 to 4 weeks anyway.

-- StephaneLenclud - 25 Jan 2008

Oh, I see. Well, Wysiwyg only works with PatternSkin. NatSkin uses NatEditContrib exclusively and wysiwyging and nateditting has not been integrated yet, although there are patches available. NatEditContrib is currently being rewritten from scratch to be a jquery plugin, offering a tabbed interface.

-- MichaelDaum - 25 Jan 2008

Sounds good! So you would have a TinyMCE tab and a raw tab for instance? Apparently people are busy doing fixes for NatSkin see Bugs:Item515. When do you think you can publish that brand new NatEditContrib and NatSkin integration?

-- StephaneLenclud - 25 Jan 2008

Maybe I just messed up my local installation, but so far, I cannot get printing to work for topics using NatSkin. I print by clicking on "Print" in the top bar (which appends ?cover=print.nat to the URL). Only the first few pages are printed from Opera and Firefox; IE 6 works for me, though.

I'm using TWiki 4.2.0 RC2, NatSkin dating from November 13th 2007.

Did anybody else see this as well?

-- ClausBrod - 26 Jan 2008

At least wrt firefox, have a look at this bug. Note, this bug is nearly 6 years old.

-- MichaelDaum - 27 Jan 2008

In 4.2, after installing all required plugins, they don't appear on http://our_organization.com/twiki/bin/view/TWiki/InstalledPlugins ... However, their topics exist if I find them manually eg: http://our_organization.com/twiki/bin/view/TWiki/NatSkin ... The "test if installed" link works A-OK.

Suggestion if/when you upgrade to 4.2.x: Make sure the plugins are listed properly in the installed plugins topic. At first I thought the install didn't work for some reason, but after reinstalling, I double-checked and noticed this...

-- KevinFirko - 28 Jan 2008

Hi Michael, I've created my own Variation called MyOwnVariation and for some reason the banner image is a different size in different webs. This is what I've got set in %MAINWEB%.TWikiPreferences:

    *  Set SKIN = nat
    *  Set SKINSTYLE = Kubrik
    *  Set STYLEBORDER = on
    *  Set STYLEBUTTONS = on
    *  Set STYLESIDEBAR = off
    *  Set STYLESEARCHBOX = pos1
    *  Set STYLEPATH = NatSkin 

And in MyOwnVariation.css, I've got :

.natHeaderArt {
  background-position:top center;

As you can see, the banner image is only 120 pixels high. But sometimes, in some webs, the skin creates the banner anywhere between 97 and 136 pixels high.

What can I do to make it so the banner is always a fixed size (for example, 120 pixels) ?

Also.. is it now possible to disable the BREADCRUMBS ? For example, by turning off a certain WEBCOMPONENT ?


-- KeithHelfrich - 31 Jan 2008

* Bug using Nat with Twiki 4.2 and new Wysiwig editor. Michael, I've got the skin loaded, but I can't seem to be able to use either the edit or raw editing modes, at both do not have any way to save. The editor loads just fine the the save button at the bottom is missing. Is there something I need to do to make this work? Thanks.

Please install JQueryPlugin and NatEditContrib. These are missing in the list of dependencies of NatSkin.

-- MichaelDaum - 04 Apr 2008

I'm using Twiki 4.2, and I have users on IE7 who are unable to see the edit button line too. Safari and Firefox are fine, and the users have no problems, only IE.

I've checked all the dependencies, and I have JQueryPlugin and NatEditContrib installed. Also, before I traced the problem to Natskin, I'd updated to the latest TinyMCE and Wysiwyg plugins. No improvement.

-- JenniferRoss - 04 Apr 2008

Hello! Apologies for newbie ignorance in the following bug report/ support request :-D. I was having trouble with NatSkin, specifying the style and variants via web preferences for a BlogPlugin-type web. I traced the problem to trailing whitespace present on the end of the variables (despite not being there before saving the preferences topic), which wasn't being removed, making comparisons with the list of known values incorrectly return false. I've fixed/hacked the problem for myself by replacing the relevant instances of

. Is this an appropriate fix- if not can you suggest a better one?

-- JonathanManning - 22 Apr 2008

I never could find the answer to my banner question. It's always a different size, depending on the page that's rendered. But the work-around was to change the MyOwnVariation.css to read background-position:bottom center; instead of background-position:top center;

This means that the bottom of the image is always displayed, and even when the banner is painted at different sizes, the excess will be trimmed away from the top and the sides. But the bottom & center always remain..

The work-around works for me, because the banner is skyline oriented. As long as I provide sufficient "sky", the banner size can shrink or expand all it wants, without causing a problem.

-- KeithHelfrich - 26 Apr 2008

NatSkin and TagMe: the tags links at top of page include forms. These forms cause linebreaks in NatSkin, tho they don't in PatternSkin. It would be nice if NatSkin rendered the same as in PatternSkin.

-- FilSalustri - 18 May 2008

I just experienced a problem that drove me crazy for a short while before I figured out what was happening. I had copied over the sample NatSkin configuration settings from NatSkinConfiguration and pasted it into my local site preferences (Main.TWikiPreferences) and set them to my liking. Later, I noticed that they didn't seem to be taking even though other setting on the page were taking fine. After scratching my head and trying different things, I finally discovered that the settings had an empty space after them and this made them not work. I deleted the trailing spaces and they took.

-- LynnwoodBrown - 19 May 2008

Problem with 4.2.0 and NatSkin. I have a test topic (http://deseng.ryerson.ca/t/bin/view/Sandbox/TestNatSkin) that (I think) sets all the variables properly. But USERACTIONS as I use it doesn't do anything. I've read the doc carefully and can't figure it out.

Can anyone help?

-- FilSalustri - 21 May 2008


I have problem with Natskin in TWiki 4.1.

I was using pattern skin from long time and recently installed Natskin in 4.1 after trying it in 4.2.

The issue what I face is, it is not allowing ssl login. It goes back to the normal http://**, after submitting the login form, which is not allowed in our case.

Any help will be appreciated.


-- PrajishS - 19 Jun 2008

Check your $TWiki::cfg{DefaultUrlHost} = "https://..."; settings.

-- MichaelDaum - 19 Jun 2008

It is https://** and looks very fine. the login manager is template login

-- PrajishS - 19 Jun 2008

Then Set HTTPSLOGIN = on in your Main.TWikiPreferences.

-- MichaelDaum - 19 Jun 2008

I did set it on. And I made changes in the bin/.htaccess as you have mentioned in some post.

But it didn't help.

-- PrajishS - 19 Jun 2008

No solutions?? frown I'm working on upgrading TWiki from. 4.1.2 to 4.2 Hope that will help...

-- PrajishS - 20 Jun 2008

Is there any way to use NatSkin without NatEdit? The NatEdit buttons above the TinyMCE buttons add unnecessary complexity to the interface.

-- JoshHanson - 21 Jul 2008

No, NatEditContrib is the natural choice together with NatSkin, being an integral part of it formerly. NatEditContrib and TinyMCE are incompatible. Only solution for now is to disable TinyMCE.

-- MichaelDaum - 22 Jul 2008

TinyMCE seems to work well with NatSkin already. When it's installed, I get the NatEdit buttons right above the TinyMCE buttons. If I simply ignore the NatEdit buttons, then TinyMCE seems to work as expected.

You say that NatEdit is the "natural choice..." natural to whom? It's perfect for me, but the users of this particular system are very busy and not very tech-savvy, and a wysiwyg editor is the difference between them using the system tentatively vs. not using it at all. The CEO is /not/ going to learn TWiki markup no matter how much a lowly tech guy like me would like him to. Neither are most of the other users, who are already stressed out by 10 hours a day of mind-numbing work.

I certainly understand that you design NatSkin for your own use, and share it with anybody who has similar usage patterns. But by imposing certain "features" instead of making them optional, you significantly reduce the number of people who can use your system.

As it is, it looks like I'm going to have to modify PatternSkin myself to try to make it look as good as NatSkin while still providing the features I need... far more work than I'd like, since NatSkin gives me 99% of what I need, but then unfortunately disables one standard feature that is essential to my intranet wiki: the wysiwyg editor.

-- JoshHanson - 22 Jul 2008

I want to reinforce what Josh said. There must be at least an option to turn off WYSIWYG. It is nice and all that it is a feature, but in some cases it is an undesirable feature.

Ideally there would be a config variable, something like Set NATEDIT = off, failing that there needs to be a way to put in the actions an option to use straight old text box based editing.

The issue I'm specifically running into is that NatEdit corrupts text. It looks like it adds a random number of spaces to the end of every line when it grabs the topic text. So even if you switch to non-wysiwyg its too late, those spaces are already there... This is worse than bad because it means every single time anyone edits a topic and tries to set things like variables, spaces end up in them. This will take your whole TWiki out cold if you happen to edit any topics containing preference variables, like say a web preferences topic (or even a TWikiUser page). Just can't have that.

NatSkin is GREAT, but this one thing is a show stopper for me.

-- TodHarter - 03 Aug 2008

off WYSIWYG == goto configure, and disable WysiwygPlugin.

-- SvenDowideit - 03 Aug 2008

Tod, never ever seen the issue you reported. Which TWiki version and which browser are you using?

-- MichaelDaum - 03 Aug 2008

Once I enable NatSkin (e.g., by adding 'skin=nat' to the url or the web preferences), I can't edit pages anymore. All I get is the following error message:

Insecure dependency in require while running with -T switch at /usr/lib$ AutoLoader::AUTOLOAD() called at /usr/lib/perl/5.8/POSIX.pm line 15 POSIX::import('POSIX', 'ceil') called at /home/exre/exre.org/twiki/lib/TWiki/Plugins/Fi$ TWiki::Plugins::FilterPlugin::Core::BEGIN() called at /usr/lib/perl/5.8/POSIX.pm line 22 eval {...} called at /usr/lib/perl/5.8/POSIX.pm line 22 require TWiki/Plugins/FilterPlugin/Core.pm called at (eval 167) line 1 TWiki::Plugins::FilterPlugin::BEGIN() called at /usr/lib/perl/5.8/POSIX.pm line 22

Apart from that, everything else seems to work fine. Any idea how to resolve this issue? I really would like to be able to use Nat, it's so much nicer than Pattern...

-- FabianDorsch - 23 Aug 2008

This is a perl/UTF8 problem. These kind of errors show up in irregular places. Please check your LocalSite.cfg. Try setting $TWiki::cfg{UseLocale} = 1.

-- MichaelDaum - 25 Aug 2008

Thanks, that did the trick!

-- FabianDorsch - 25 Aug 2008

Just upgraded from 4.1.2 to 4.2.2 and the latest NatSkin last week-end. Some of the functionality I implemented in Bugs:Item3768 are broken. So I get the wrong links in my pop-up menus frown Look-up for that bug number above to get more information.

-- StephaneLenclud - 26 Aug 2008

I have another annoying bug. I'm getting %TOPICTITLE% as topic title when doing edit or natsearch.

-- StephaneLenclud - 27 Aug 2008

edit seems quite slow from remote location. I'm under the impression it re-downloads the same bitmaps every time you edit a page. Maybe its just my upstream that's the making it slow.

-- StephaneLenclud - 27 Aug 2008

In fact I get %TOPICTITLE% as page title pretty much everywhere but on topic view. So for instance https://slion.net/oops/Dev/PerlHome/SymAppGen/pl/Txt?skin=clean.nat%2Cnat;template=oopsattention;def=no_such_attachment;param1=viewfile;param2=SymAppGen.pl.txt;template=oopsattention;def=no_such_attachment;param1=viewfile;param2=SymAppGen.pl.txt shows that broken title. That oops URL also contains CSS style as part of it's body so things like .natMain h1 are showing at the top of the page.

-- StephaneLenclud - 28 Aug 2008

Will have a look at it.

-- MichaelDaum - 29 Aug 2008

I solved my NatSkinDev issue by installing DBCachePlugin and Contrib.

It seems it should be fair to add to NatSkinPlugin a dependency on DBCachePlugin since NatSkin needs NatSkinDev. Another solution would to have NatSkinPlugin register a lightweight NatSkinDev if DBCachePlugin is not installed.

-- StephaneLenclud - 31 Aug 2008

I thought I did exactly this. Checking ...

-- MichaelDaum - 01 Sep 2008

Hi! In our 4.2 TWiki we use Nat skin, however we also want to try out Kino search. Unfortunately there is no kinosearch.nat.tmpl . Copying kinosearch.pattern.tmpl has not helped, so I need a working kinosearch.nat.tmpl template. I am newbee to this .tmpl, so I dare to ask if someone have a working kinosearch.nat.tmpl that they want to share with us?

-- AtleGundersen - 22 Sep 2008

Atle, I was working on it but I had to stop. Once I have the time to work non it again I'll share the tmpl...

-- CarloSchulz - 12 Oct 2008

@Josh: TinyMCE and NatSkin - editor without Buttons

My solution is not very nifty, but it works for me.

1. Copy the edit.nat.tmpl into e.g. edit.tinynat.tmpl
2. Replace the TMPL:DEF "textarea" of edit.nat.tmpl with the TMPL:DEF "textarea" of edit.pattern.tmpl
3. Switch in pub/TWiki/EditContrib/jquery.natedit.js in defaults the value for hideToolbar: true,

Now it works fine, when you call the editor with ?skin=tinynat,nat

Thus you can use natedit (without toolbar) and TinyMCE at the same time.

-- WolfMarbach - 13 Oct 2008

I needed to install "AliasPlugin" additionally to the plugins mentioned at your installation instructions. Regards, Felix

-- FelixDreher - 23 Oct 2008

Hi, I'm running TWiki version TWiki-4.2.0, Tue, 22 Jan 2008, build 16278, Plugin API version 1.2. I have a problem with the settings for NatSkin whereby it seems to ignore settings in the TWiki.TWikiPreferences. After a day of trying various things, I moved the settings to Main.TWikiPreferences and it works fine. Has anyone had this issue or is it peculiar to my installation?

Furthermore, after installing NatSkin via the configure page, I also found that the WYSIWYG was corrupting my TWikiPreferences page by adding loads of spaces after the lines. This impacted the TWikiDocGraphics setting, which in turn affected all graphics / icons. I used vi to manually edit the page and remove the whitespace. For example, the Icon html source was being set to TWikiDocGraphics/%20%20%20%20%20icon.gif because the TWikiPreferences had the line Set ICONTOPIC = TWikiDocGraphics but it had about 8 trailing spaces after the TWikiDocGraphics text. It also seems to have screwed up the bullet list settings, which I had to cut and paste from http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/view/TWiki/TWikiPreferences?raw=on in order to repair it.

Plugin versions are:

  • SpreadSheetPlugin (any TWiki, $Rev: 16273 (25 Jan 2008) $): Add spreadsheet calculation like "$SUM( $ABOVE() )" to TWiki tables and other topic text
  • ActionTrackerPlugin (21 May 2007, $Rev: 16657 (13 Apr 2008) $): Adds support for action tags in topics, and automatic notification of action statuses
  • BreadCrumbsPlugin (v2.01, $Rev: 0 (01 Sep 2008) $): A flexible way to display breadcrumbs navigation
  • CommentPlugin (TWiki-4, $Rev: 15776 (22 Jan 2008) $): Allows users to quickly post comments to a page without an edit/preview/save cycle
  • DBCachePlugin (2.01, $Rev: 16969 (03 Jul 2008) $): Lightweighted frontend to the DBCacheContrib
  • EditTablePlugin (4.7.10, $Rev: 16239 (22 Jan 2008) $): Edit TWiki tables using edit fields, date pickers and drop down boxes
  • FilterPlugin (1.51, $Rev: 16970 (03 Jul 2008) $): Substitute and extract information from content by using regular expressions
  • FlexWebListPlugin (v1.23, $Rev: 16971 (03 Jul 2008) $): Flexible way to display hierarchical weblists
  • GluePlugin (2.00, $Rev: 15708 (03 Jul 2008) $): Enable markup to span multiple lines
  • IfDefinedPlugin (v1.02, $Rev: 16972 (03 Jul 2008) $): Render content conditionally
  • InterwikiPlugin (Dakar, $Rev: 14913 (17 Sep 2007) $): Link ExternalSite:Page text to external sites based on aliases defined in a rules topic
  • JQueryPlugin (0.90, $Rev: 17031 (16 Jul 2008) $): jQuery JavaScript library for TWiki
  • JQueryTwistyPlugin (1.2, $Rev: 16736 (03 Jul 2008) $): Twisty section JavaScript library to open/close content dynamically
  • NatSkinPlugin (3.00-pre20, $Rev: 16978 (03 Jul 2008) $): Theming engine for NatSkin
  • PreferencesPlugin (TWiki-4.2, $Rev: 15484 (05 Nov 2007) $): Allows editing of preferences using fields predefined in a form
  • RedDotPlugin (1.40, $Rev: 16137 (03 Jan 2008) $): Renders edit-links as little red dots
  • RenderListPlugin (2.0, $Rev: 16235 (22 Jan 2008) $): Render bullet lists in a variety of formats
  • SlideShowPlugin (Any TWiki, $Rev: 15091 (22 Jan 2008) $): Create web based presentations based on topics with headings.
  • SmiliesPlugin (Dakar, $Rev: 16049 (22 Jan 2008) $): Render smilies as icons, like for smile or for eek!
  • TablePlugin (1.032, $Rev: 16182 (22 Jan 2008) $): Control attributes of tables and sorting of table columns
  • TinyMCEPlugin (TWiki-4, $Rev: 16268 (22 Jan 2008) $): Integration of TinyMCE? with WysiwygPlugin
  • TwistyPlugin (1.4.9, $Rev: 15653 (19 Nov 2007) $): Twisty section JavaScript library to open/close content dynamically
  • WysiwygPlugin (TWiki-4.2, $Rev: 16174 (22 Jan 2008) $): Translator framework for Wysiwyg editors

Everything is working okay for me now, so I guess this is an FYI for anyone else that has the problems. I also had the TOPICNAME problems mentioned above and after installing the DBCachePlugin, the issue is resolved.

-- AndrewRobinson - 24 Oct 2008

every time I use natsearch it throws 4 warnings into the web log:

natsearch: Use of uninitialized value in bless at /hfs/d1/webs/main/cgi-bin/common/twiki/lib/TWiki/Sandbox.pm line 65.

natsearch: Explicit blessing to '' (assuming package main) at /hfs/d1/webs/main/cgi-bin/common/twiki/lib/TWiki/Sandbox.pm line 65.

natsearch: Use of uninitialized value in string eq at /hfs/d1/webs/main/cgi-bin/common/twiki/lib/TWiki/Sandbox.pm line 87.

natsearch: Use of uninitialized value in string eq at /hfs/d1/webs/main/cgi-bin/common/twiki/lib/TWiki/Sandbox.pm line 87.

These appear to be generated because in the NatSkinPlugin::Search module, no class or OS information are being passed in to the Sandbox module. Am I missing something?

-- HughWilliams - 07 Jan 2009

Looks like a bug in the NatSkinPlugin.

-- PeterThoeny - 08 Jan 2009

Topic attachments
I Attachment History Action Size Date Who Comment
PNGpng NatSkin-HeaderTextBug.png r1 manage 4.9 K 2007-10-15 - 15:39 MarcoPoli Persistent extra text seen on the header of my TWiki installations
PNGpng NatSkin_result.png r1 manage 13.9 K 2007-11-25 - 04:23 VickiBrown weird result with SKIN - nat
PNGpng broken_lease_conflict.png r1 manage 3.7 K 2007-04-23 - 13:25 CarloSchulz lbroken ease conflict template
Texttxt installNatSkin.pl.txt r1 manage 2.7 K 2007-01-12 - 03:12 StephaneLenclud Quick and dirty NatSkin installer
Texttxt lineprefixpatch.txt r1 manage 0.9 K 2007-03-09 - 17:04 StephaneLenclud WEBCOMPONENT lineprefix patch, allows for indentation.
Texttxt natsearch.patch.txt r2 r1 manage 0.8 K 2007-06-03 - 00:24 JohnHampton Patch to fix search case sensitivity.
Unknown file formatdiff oopsmore.nat.tmpl.backlinks.diff r1 manage 1.0 K 2006-08-21 - 23:15 ThomasFreudenberg oopsmore.nat.tmpl.diff (pre-4) - additional form element with standard backlinks
Texttxt slpatch.txt r1 manage 2.1 K 2007-03-10 - 09:13 StephaneLenclud Add web, lineprefix and multiple parameter to WEBCOMPONENT
Edit | Attach | Watch | Print version | History: r278 < r277 < r276 < r275 < r274 | Backlinks | Raw View | Raw edit | More topic actions
Topic revision: r278 - 2009-01-08 - PeterThoeny
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