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The CoffeeBreak page seems to be broken. It shows up in changes as 20 Nov 2001 - 19:39 - r1.64, yet when I go to the page it is empty and previous revisions are not available.

UsabilityIssues, last edited 21 Nov 2001 - 13:33 - r1.6 also seems to have disappeared, though it's contents seem to have moved to UsabilityIdeas. This latter page was last edited 21 Nov 2001 - 13:36, however it does not show up in changes.

According to WebChanges, CoffeeBreak and UsabilityIssues do not exist at all.

According to changes they exist, they're just empty. Why don't these two links show up as broken in this changes list (as well)?

Is this a result of clumsy moving, a bug, or something more sinister?

I didn't know before that WebChanges is not the same as http://twiki.org/cgi-bin/changes/Codev. Is this on purpose? Why? Is it temporary or a permanent and abiding feature?

(PS. There is no TopicClassification for this kind of topic/question. Is this a bug report about the software, or a bug report about the contents of Codev, or would it be better left unclassified, or ...?)

-- MattWilkie - 21 Nov 2001

Matt, There is some kind of BUG here, I believe; it was discussed a while back but I forget what the outcome was. Isn't it under one of the Bug categories? When a topic is deleted to Trash, a title seems to remain in the original web, in WebChanges. Also (some?) links link to the moved topic in the Trash web. Not my department, but annoying!

BTW, CoffeeBreak is now DevOpinionPoll, but there's a link to it as CoffeeBreak in the usual spot on WebHome. And UsabilityIssues is...defunct, collapsed into UsabilityIdeas. Controversial night moves...

-- MikeMannix - 21 Nov 2001

With regard to conflating multiple topics into one, it would probably be a good policy to leave the source pages up for a period (day? week? month?) with a short comment about the move.

Getting the bug fixed would help too : )

-- MattWilkie - 22 Nov 2001

Absoloutely, re, leaving pointers. Another reason is to maintain the original versions in RCS in case "refactoring" goes "wrong" and the orig needs consulting. Trash doesn't delete, but is less convenient, unavailable to all. STILL, and I mentioned this to Peter a day ago, I'm going slow - and I can stop - in the MasterRefactor, because when it gets past the grouping to the editing, organizing hundreds of topics with criss-crossed content is going to be brutal - feathers will ruffle. CoffeeBreak, which still lives, - in TWO places, thanks to Martin <g> - was a small example of the effect of changing stuff. CB is great to have, a nice thought, but was mostly used for dev discussion, and not voluntarily refactored, making it eventually unusable for the original purpose - take a look. I removed it deliberately, on that basis, partially to see the effect. Wiki is the "no one-webmaster bottleneck" solution - what happens when people don't self-maintain?

UsabilityIssues I unilaterally killed because: 1. it was new, no version history; 2. I'd inititated it; 3. there was minimal content: two one-para points, I believe, one of them mine; 4. nobody had been using it! - it was intended as a utility suggestion box type page, not a one-topic discussion, and no one used it. So why prolong this new bit of clutter? A clean break is sometimes best.

Perhaps the real issue is the ghost listing after the deletion - out of sight, out of mind. Which is the larger point, with many features come many more expectations! What's the saying: "Great expectations are the devil's playground"?

Your vigilance and comments are great! MasterRefactor is optional - I can do the docs without it. All response is support, 'cause I'm not doing it just for myself!

-- MikeMannix - 22 Nov 2001

EmptyNotificationAfterRenamingTopic has been fixed.

-- PeterThoeny - 23 Nov 2001

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Topic revision: r6 - 2001-11-23 - PeterThoeny
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